A point that has been missed in the discussions to date is the Canadian who is offended by invasive threatening big brother and simply lies on the form. So much for the much touted accuracy.

I have objected to the mandatory census for years (long or short). I fill out questions that I consider important for the planners to know (age of children, number of residents in the house, etc), but refuse to give accurate data on income, names, etc. On two census occasions, I was threatened with being charged if I didn’t comply (contrary to what Charlie Angus says), so gave answers, but not accurate ones (there is nothing on the form requiring truthful information). Since I feel severely over-taxed I always say my after-tax income is $0. There is often an obvious slant toward the disabled, but I get a sore back and have a daughter with asthma, so I usually indicate that all members of the household are disabled(just about everyone has some sort of infirmity). If Statistics Canada insist on bullying me for information I don’t think they are entitled to, I can guarantee the information will not be correct. When they have threatened me, I have included horses and dogs as dependents (they are).

Eliminating the long form census may actually result in better information, since those who participate will be willing to do so.

It is not an issue of partisanship or fear mongering. It is an issue of being able to use census data for planning purposes. Every ethnic group and minority, visible or not, wants to have this data and has been using it successfully and without privacy issues for decades.

Agree with Peter Coleman. The while thing is political posturing by the Liberals.

This appears to be a “tempest in a teapot”.

I believe the long form should be scrapped. This is a case of our over
paid bureaucrats being miffed at not getting their way. I also don’t like
being threatened with fines and jail if the census is not completed. What
ever happened to democracy in this country?

Scrap the long form. It is not necessary.

Please correct me if I’m wrong, but not counting HOC voting, I don’t believe the Liberals have verbally supported and/or applauded a single policy position expressed by the Conservative Government since the 1st day the Liberals were the Official Opposition.

If I’m incorrect, please, some angry Liberal out there, list 5 or 10 such CPC proposals supported by the Liberals since Harper et al were elected in 2006. I think many uncommitted voters would like to know the answer to this question.

In the absence of any significant Opposition support for at least a few Government policy proposals (not counting votes of support or abstentions) which were only done to enable the Liberals to avoid having to face a federal election, is it credible that the Liberals would have been unable to support virtually any such proposed Bills? Or have the last two parliaments been about politics, not governance?

This premise, if irrefutable with facts (as opposed to mere rhetoric), brings into question Liberal Party integrity on all HOC issues, including the Census issues, the central point of this NCC Blog.

You are correct. There is no reason in a free society or even a nominally freee society like Canada, that the invasion of privacy known as the “long form” should be compulsory.

The more they use force to get information, the more lies they will get, which in turn will compromise their data base.
It is self defeating, and I am willing to push it along.

A rational government concerned about restricting its involvement in society to only the legitimate activities of justice and defence does not need to collect information of any nature whatsoever from its citizens. Let the vested interests hoot and holler. The less the social engineers know about the society they hope to regulate, the better it will be for those of us who wish to get the dead weight of government off our back.

I’m tired of the harrassment that Stats Canada put on my small business too. They constantly send form after form which creates an unreasonable burden on my busniess.

It’s about time that someone stops these government sanctioned bullies.

Canada has, by all acounts, the best national statistics system in the world.One major reason for this is the absolute integrity of the system. Part of the reason for this has been scrupulous hands off by the politicians. In the current case for example the govt. could have eliminated the long form altogether and regretable as this would have been and as disrup[tive of the information flow, within the purvue of government to do. Instead they said that the methodology would change. The long form would continue but be vvoluntary thus violating a number of statistical principles. If this kind of interference can be achieved by this government what prevents any government in future from fiddling the system in thier favor. I am concerned that we have headed down a slippery slope and will end up unable in future to trust data from Statistics Canada. The implications are very serious.

I agree with scrapping the long form. I will answer the short form only. How much bureacracy goes into this? How many thousands of dollars are spent to sift through this information that is not guaranteed to be true. It is a waste of time.
I thought the “census” meant TO TAKE THE OFFICIAL COUNT OF POPULATION ETC. now it seems to be spreading requesting other information.
SCRAP IT!!!!

I have never had to fill out a long form census therefore I have no idea what the additional question are that are not on the short form. My question is if the additional questions on the long form are so important then why the short form? I wonder how the additional questions asked on the long form can be considered accurate when the questions are only asked to a small percentage of Canadians? I also wonder if all of the additional questions asked on the long form are necessary? Because not all Canadians receive the long form what method does Stats Canada use to come up with an overall Canadian statistic? Would it be assumed that because, for example, that 51% of Canadians answered a long form question a certain way that this would mean that at least 51% of all Canadians would have answered the same question the same way?

When citizens have to fill out government forms under threat of fines or jail terms, they are definitely living in a police state. Is this what Canada is?? I hope not. Is a police state what the opposition wants?? I believe it is. I rest my case.
Judy

Generally, I applaud the stance of the NCC on this issue. However, I was unimpressed by some of Mr. Coleman’s testimony. He failed altogether to address the question of whether fines should be applied against people who fail to complete the long form (instead he kept harping on the possibility of jail time). In addition, he became diverted into discussions of what should be the questions included in the long form.

Personally, I find some of the questions included in the long form (e.g. race, hours of unpaid housework, etc.) seem to have indirect policy implications for example in setting employment quotas, or encouraging someone to demand remuneration for ‘unpaid housework’. In my opinion, the long form should be scrapped altogether because of its sometimes toxic policy implications (small wonder the Liberals and NDP love it) and Stats Can should examine whether even the short form is required (much of this information can be gathered from telephone directories, property records, birth and death records, etc. Several countries have abandoned traditional censuses altogether. We could propably do the same while improving the quality of our records since updates would be continuous instead of every five years (five year old data is seriously out-of-date in our modern world).

People do not realize the number of people who will be out of work without the long form to assist them. If you’re worried that “Big Government” may get too much info, forget that, they already have everything they need!

I value our “old” census data immensely (1871, 1891, 1901, etc.), as it has enabled me to find some of my ancestors in the 1800s. But surely that information is still being collected on the short form census, which is and should always be collected. The census should be used exactly for what it was intended, which is to count the population, which helps maintain a rep-by-pop democracy, or in Canadas case, shows how far we are from having a rep by pop democracy.

Sorry Peter you do not offer any clerity. I am NOT a member or support any party because they only care for themselves. There are bigger issues that need to be dealt with. If the conservatice party is so concern about spending money, HE should NOT have had the G8 & G20 and their numerous FREELOADERS which they bring along which makes the event just a holiday.
HARPER just wanted to make himself important for the BIG BOYS just like CHRETIEN use to do. I might find some respect for the majority of politicians when they start caring & listening to the TAXPAYERS and NOT the Lobbyists. People are SICK of our lying politicians. PS Peter when NCC starts seeing things this way, NCC may increase its membership.
get more members.

I have never seen the “long form” census; therefore I’m in no position to judge its efficacy compared to the “short form”. Exactly what questions are in the long form that causes so many Canadians to be upset,and how can the resulting information be used against us in any harmful way? When I get accurate answers instead of political posturing I shall decide for myself. Fair enough?

I don’t often disagree with the NCC, but in this instance I do. The supposed invasion of privacy that is represented by the long form is minimal and those who choose to lie on the form to show their displeasure are, let’s be honest, behaving like petulant children.

The information provided on the form is not linked to the respondent so there is little chance of its being compromised. In my view the Tories have built themselves a crisis when there was absolutely no reason to do so and no justification for doing so. In my view they should reverse their decision.

I have never seen the long form census either. I think Canadians will be more likely to fill in more falsified info than years ago. That info is important to Canada so we can forecast economy and future events and therefore I have no trouble being a part of that.

The problem I see now, is the lies and greed we find in all walks of life. The “All about me” attitude that is prevalent.

I would still be happy to fill out the long form with the best info possible. But I have become so cynical, I would question why certain things are asked.

I think you are absolutely correct in your analysis. It is sad but true, the press via a few power groups can put any spin they want on most any issue. I wonder who the pollsters asked when they revealed the two parties are in a dead heat?

I can’t wait to get my hands on a long form so I can thumb my nose against intrusive government invasion into my life. It has not been explained to me why the random distribution of a compulsory long form is more accurate than random return of a larger number of voluntary long forms. All of the survey data on voter intentions is based on the opinion of less than 3000 respondents so why is the response by perhaps millions not accurate? I need more than theory than certain demographics are less likely to answer when the long form is voluntary and therefore the data less accurate. Since everyone answers the short form, demographic statistical data can be used to normalize or weight the data. That’s why we employ statisticians so they can do what they are supposed to do. Forget the crap about the survey being minimally invasive and that data is not linked to individuals. And don’t call my refusal to participate the act of a petulant child as name calling is just as childish. My privacy concerns are to be taken seriously and like one of the earlier posters I will only give data that I think is relevant and necessary. I will answer the questions but no guaranty that they will be true! Take that Mr. Sheikh!

This is just another example of Liberal Party desperation for a “cause”. They’ve tried to manufacture a crisis from proroguing parliament,Copenhagen,Afghan detainees,and this one won’t resonate with the average taxpayer either,just a few special interest groups.

But the Liberals will keep trying to find the issue that will sway Canadians to their side and an election victory. It’s pathetic,really. Is fear mongering the only method the Liberals know?

How about a credible leader and a platform that will give Canadians an idea of how the Liberals can do a better job in government than the Conservatives?

I agree with dmorris.The Liberals are a bunch of hypocrites.
Scrap the long form census.