The Senate is no longer a useful or necessary tool. The existing parties in power do not utilize the Senate with respect of their decision making and it is only in existance to provide a generous spot for cronies of the past prime ministers. This has got to stop.

Also, the politicians spend too much time dealing with non-issues and we should get them back to basics and looking after Health, Education, Infrastructure (have you seen the TransCanada Hiway of late) and Administration of our resources. The rest will fall into place. Lets quit spending our dollars to gain votes - lets put them to some good use!

Your comments are bang on Peter.
For many years I suggested that the elected Senate should be decided not by all Canadians, but only by those Canadian Citizen voters who pay more in taxes to the government than they draw from government by way of wages & salaries, pensions, contracts, etc. What do you think of that twist?
Bill

If we get a senate that limits the term to 8 years , what will the government do for those “retirees” in the way of a pension ?

If the senate is costly now , consider the cost of the pensions as the number of retired senators increases .

Will the government tell the people what an elected senate will cost
for compensation for retired senators , along with the other costs of
having a “reformed senate” ?

Hello,
The proposal for an accountable and democratic Upper House is one of those ideas that looks great at first glance but makes no sense in practice. Electing the Senate would diminish the power of the House of Commons. And why, pray tell, do we want to do that?

Sure the Senate is an anachronism, filled with cronies, doesn’t represent the people, etc., etc. All true. But in fixing this problem, why would we attack the powers of the House of Commons? In all the comments I’ve seen about how the Senate fumbles around in its dotage I’ve yet to see a coherent argument about why the House of Commons needs to be reigned in.

Incidently, Coleman reveals the real direction all this reform talk is headed in his choice of language: “checks and balances”. Sound familiar? We once had a British system of government that was severely if not mortally wounded with the introduction of the Charter of Rights and Freedoms. No surprise then that calls are out to further Americanize our system by introducing an elected Senate.

Here’s an idea. Why don’t we just pack it all in and apply for membership in the United States? What’s the point in trying to run a different style political system up here anyway? Join the U.S. and we’ll have an accountable and democratic Senate and all the checks and balances we need.

What’s with this fixed term thing for the Senate. We don’t live in the US. If people want to serve in office for as long as they want and the people who vote agree why should we place limits on that.
This is the thin edge of the wedge if agreed upon. We will next be saying why not MPs, PM’s, mayors, etc.
I don’t agree with an elected senate. The last thing this country needs is another set of elected politicians (who will feel legitimate if elected) looking for smething to do in a Sente unreformed reprsentatively.
My suggestion leave as is or abolish.

Who needs a second sobre thought in the first place? There is no such thing in the provincial system, so why do we need it in the federal system. Take the savings from paying for all of the pomp and the pompous and use it for child aid in Africa.

Yes, the senate should be reformed. First and foremost an elected senate. No age limit should be placed on an elected senator. Should the people want that person, age should not be part of the criteria. There should be a limited number of senators from each province based on population. We do not need a large nuber of senators. Perhaps 50 at the most. Each term should be fixed at four years. Not all senators term should begin at the same time. Perhaps 1/2 every second year.

R.M. Sleeth

Your emphasis on a Senate that is to be both democratic and accountable is laughable. Where did you dredge these weary ‘principles’ up from? We want a Senate comprising Senators who are among the finest citizens of our country and who are non-partisan. I would recommend the creation of an independent body to find them and to appoint them–for an indefinite term of office. If senators are to be elected we will get the same sort of pitiful, partisan, self-seeking nonentities that fill the House of Commons today. The judiciary is appointed and non-partisan, thank heavens; our Civil Service is appointed and non-partisan; and thank heavens for that too. Why, even our political parties are not democratic or accountable. Party leaders can veto constituency association selections, and can parachute selected candidates into constituencies for election. Let’s get serious about who we elect and appoint to office.

I think an elected senate is a step in the right direction with an 8 year term. One would have to resign the seat, but could run again in 8 years. One thing, we do not need as many as we have now. It should be representation by Province. Say, five per province. All it is now is a retirement home for defeated politicians, with a huge slush fund and expense accounts, with members showing up just when they please. Very costly and ineffective. We’ve talked about this long enough. Let’s get it done! Put a cap on their pension entitlment too, then, we can get a higher income tax exemption.

Some changes in the appointments to the senate would be welcome. I suggest appointment by each provincial government. Terms might be limited to 10 to 12 years. A senate that can bring sanity to some of the Commons most egregious bills is the only way to prevent a rush of “Charter Cases” to the Supreme Court.

The Senate in its own way has done great service to this country by many appointees, and many of them Liberals. Liberals in the Senate are often have a whole different outlook than the Commons.

Don’t abolish the Senate. Improve it. Don’t elect senators, that would only raise the conflict when there is a difference. The Commons can override the senate, and that is proper, but there better be a good reason for it, or the government will pay at the next election.

The whole country needs to be reformed - from the Senate on down. Our health care is going thru the roof yet nothing can be done (wrong - read Politics in Healng by Danel Haley), our provinces have trade barriers, our defence is the laughing stock of the free world, our security is pathetic - so, let’s start with the Senate, make it accountable and realistic or get rid of it, then move on. We need to start to get this country ‘free’ from the ridiculous chains of ‘inefficiency’ that has become the standard Canadians are forced to accept today.

I agree with the proposal to reform the Senate along the lines suggested by the NCC

Yes - it absolutely needs reforming and revanping! I wonder how a totally NON-POLITICAL Senate would function. Each Senator elected but without Political Party affiliation! Just musing!

I think Canadians have endured the Senate much too long and it is time we abolish it. There is no good reason why Canadians should waste their hard earned money on continuing to pay for the members of the Senate.
The Senate Members do not contribute anything of value to our political structure and most of them could not do an honest day of work in the private world. The attendance is very low!!
Reduce our tax burden and issue the famous “pink slip”.

I used to believe in senate reform but the time has come to completely abolish it. It’s is nothing but a trough for patronage appointments and will never function properly in Canada because of the useless parliamentary system that has not been modernized at all. We are already over governed, over taxed and over regulated.
And what’s wrong with term limits anyway? Do we really need career politicians that use and abuse the system, get patronage jobs and become arrogant know-it-alls. Quite frankly I am tired of politicians that think they know everything and really know nothing at all… It would be nice to have a system that held them more accountable for their actions….

Attention: Peter Coleman and Susan Reville

If the Senate was, as of a future date, simply dismantled and all these government plants of by-gone days be sent home, the government would, and could, consider objectively the need of such sober thought and how best to provide it, if needed.

Seems to me that parlament has shed it`s decision making responsibility to the Supreme Cout, and committees who produce reports that lay on shelves collecting dust. Maybe we should disband the parlament and keep the Senate since it is supposed to be better able to sort out what is best for the country than parlament.

For the public to enter the debate re the need for a senate, it needs to be convinced it is needed. So you or someone should send to Canadians a brief description of what the Senate is legislated to do, in fact whether they are doing it without conflict of interest.

They should, if needed, NOT be appointed by, or because of, any political stripe. Elected by public ballot seems to be fair, but with significant qualification for nomination. And their term of office shoud be limited and salary would NOT be paid if they are not on duty.

That is my 5 cents worth. Keep up the good work.

Respectfully BILL MACLEAN

Where was the referendum to decide if “the Quebecois” should made a “nation”?
Wasn’t one.
So why should “Canadians” need a referendum to decide anything?
Hold a referendum when it’s popular and stick your tail between your legs when it isn’t?
67% of Canadians support reforming the Senate but over 70% were opposed to making “the Quebecois a Nation…” ?

Not sure what method should be used to reform our senate, BUT certainly some wiser heads can devise a far more efficient system that serves some useful purpose as opposed to present day old folks home for prime minister’s
‘friends”.

Sorry DAVID BAWDEN, for the senate to have ANY legitimacy in a democracy it MUST be elected by the people or cease to exist. That is why this whole discussion about senate reform is taking place. And you can see that the people have it all figured out. It just the politicians clinging to power who refuse to move forwrd on the issue.
- The senate has done nothing good for the country as far as I’m concerned because they have never had a mandate from the people to do anything.
- If the commons can override the senate then how do you justify having a senate. There is never a need for the senate under our current system because that is what happens now. The rubber stamp squad of aging ex-political brats.

I feel like a number of people to abolish the senate. Of course maybe I don’t know enough, but I do not like the way they are holding up the bills the Government is trying to pass. Why are they procrastinating. Maybe that is one way the Liberals can hinder the Conservative Party. The Liberals don’t have anything to point fingers at Mr. Harper.

Take a close look at the usefullness of the Senate by successful business persons. Publish what they achieved for taxpayers in the lasst five years. Also publish how much it cost the system (taxpayers) to operate the Senate which includes amenities of all kinds, housing, offices, supplies, etc. and then see how
the voters and taxpayers react. Thank you for publishing these comments by
thinking individuals who take the time to write in and voice their democratic and personal views. Thanks again, Stephen Gillespie.

Great comments by everyone who has posted on this issue. We have updated our web site and have included a petition with respect to the senate and we are asking for a referedum question to be held at the next federal election, so all Canadians can have a say in this matter.

Keep the comments coming- it is great to see differing opinions on this and thanks to everyone for keeping the debate courteous

Peter Coleman

I know I’m a little late here…
The one thing we DON’T need is a senate with equal representation for each province: that is totally the tail wagging the dog, and here is why. I live in Kitchener, Ontario, which is not a big deal, but it has one-and-a-half times the population of all of PEI. That means PEI would be over-represented by a factor of about eighty. Kitchener has about six times the population of a territory; even worse fractions there. But if we did it by population, there would be the crying that Ontario was getting too many because we’ve got a third of the people. I think we should just keep on the way we are: they don’t cost that much and they’re not important enough to do real harm.
Lou